The Story and Interview of an American who lived in Fatima

“I was shown a copy of the Third Secret at the time Pope John XXIII opened it and sought the advice of a group of Cardinals in 1960. One of those Cardinals was Augustin Cardinal Bea, and I was his assistant. The apostasy in the Church forms the backdrop or the context of the Third Secret. The apostasy in the Church is just beginning now. But the chastisements foretold in the Secret are very real, physical chastisements, and they are terrible!”

Father Malachi Martin  then divulged the exchange he had with Cardinal Bea, when the Cardinal, looking pale as a sheet, came out of the meeting that Pope John XXIII was holding with his advisors. “What’s  wrong your eminence? I asked him. ‘We’ve just killed a billion people. Look at this!’ He handed  me the single sheet of paper with those 25 lines of handwriting. (Sister Lucia’s handwriting-author’s  note). Since that day, every word of this text has been imprinted indelibly in my mind.” 

Cardinal Bea had made the statement about ‘a billion people’ because the Holy Father had just made the fateful decision not to release the Third Secret of Fatima and not to consecrate Russia to the Immaculate Heart of Mary in 1960, as Our Lady had asked to be done...

To purchase the complete set of amazing interviews that Bernard Janzen conducted with Father  Malachi Martin, (22CD’s) they can be ordered here: 

https://www.amazon.com/Complete-Interviews-Malachi-Martin-Bernard/dp/1928102069 

Mr. Salbato moved from Southern California to Fatima in 2000 and lived there for a number of years. Unity Publishing Inc. was his publishing ministry and he was known by many for a time  as a Fatima based Catholic journalist.  

Sister Lucia, the last of the Fatima seers, died on February 13th 2005. Mr. Salbato attended the  funeral Mass for her and claimed to have been in the presence of Sister Lucia eleven times.

File:Duas Entrevistas com a Irmã Lúcia (Português) by Carlos Evaristo 

Photograph of Sister Lúcia, one of the three children who claimed to have witnessed Marian apparitions in Fátima  between May and October 1917. Image courtesy of the cover of the Carlos Evaristo's book Duas Entrevistas com a  Irmã Lúcia. 

Rick Salbato wrote on his website the following:

“Sister Lucy of Fatima died on February 13, 2005 at 97 years of age. Doctor Branca, a gifted doctor and painter,  was at her bedside taking her pulse, and felt her last heartbeat. Lucia did not die of any sickness other than a flu that  was going around all of Portugal, and most of the nuns in Coimbra had it. Lucia just died of old age and the flu was  more than the old body could take.

I went to the funeral at the Basilica (flying in from Brazil) and then the following Saturday I was invited to a farewell Mass for Lucia, where I talked with the nuns and Doctor Branca. At the Mass they passed out for the first  time, the last words of Lucia, I assume recorded by the Doctor or Mother Superior at her bedside. The cards were  made quickly just for this farewell Mass, but in the future they will be a mainstay of gifts to anyone visiting the  convent. I knew what the words were in Portuguese, but just to be sure, I had a nun translate them into English for  me. My translation was the same and it was evident something very supernatural happened at her death. I asked  some questions and the best I can write (waiting an official report) is this...

Lucia was not going to last long, according to her doctor, as her will to live was gone, and her breathing difficult, so Doctor Branca could do nothing except wait for the end. Then suddenly Lucia moved her head from the right to the  left and back again as if wanting to see all in front of her. She was seeing something and more than one thing.

"For the Holy Father! ... Our Lady, Our Lady,

Holy Angels, Heart of Jesus, Heart of Jesus!

We are going, we are going.”

"Where?" asked Mother Celina

"To Heaven..."

"With whom" asked Mother Celina?

“With Our Lord ... Our Lady ... and the little Shepherds."

And she breathed her last...”

Mother Celina—the Prioress of the convent, where Sister Lucia lived, was a good friend of Rick Salbato.  At his suggestion, I sent a donation to Mother Celina for the construction of a museum dedicated in  memory of Sister Lucia. I received the note below in reply:

Catholic author/Fatima scholar Kevin Symonds, who specializes in the Catholic Church’s theology of private revelation, was an acquaintance of Salbato. While on a pilgrimage in Fatima  in 2005, Symonds says that he was personally able to verify that Salbato was on good terms with  Sister Lucia’s convent in Coimbra and was friends with relatives of Sister Lucia. According to  Symonds, Sister Lucia’s relatives visited her on a regular basis and Salbato drove them to the  convent.  

Symonds related that when he visited Salbato in Fatima in 2005, Symonds luggage was lost and  during the process of trying to retrieve all at the airport and with no cell phones at the time—he  and Salbato did not connect for the scheduled meetup/pickup there. Symonds subsequently made his way to Fatima (without any luggage) and stopped at a Fatima Info Center. Symonds  explained to the lady at the booth that he was trying to connect with a Rick Salbato as he was scheduled to visit with him and stay at his apartment during his pilgrimage. The lady seemed to  recognize Salbato’s name and she immediately phoned the Carmelite Sisters of St. Teresa in  Coimbra where Sister Lucia lived inquiring about how to reach a ‘Mr. Rick Salbato.’  The nun who answered the phone at the convent initially said “you mean, ‘Ricky’”?  The Sisters knew Salbato well and trusted him, and by phone, they gave the number right away to the lady at the information booth to give to Mr. Symonds. The Sisters, according to the lady at  the info center, referred to Salbato, as ‘Ricky’ and the lady at the booth wrote the name down as  ‘Ricky’ with Salbato’s phone number and handed it to Symonds.

Symonds added that Salbato “...was rather well connected, up to and including contacts in the  CIA.” Symonds related that during his visit with him in Fatima, Salbato mentioned this to him  while “looking me directly in the eye.” Symonds mentioned he did not inquire further about this, but came away convinced of the veracity of Salbato’s contention by the solemnness in which Salbato related it...

Salbato is reputed to have been the one who hand-delivered correspondence from Sister Lucia to her spiritual director Father Messias Coelho. Father Messias was the spiritual confidant to Sr.  Lucia of Fatima, and the Editor of “The Messages of Fatima”--the only official Fatima Magazine  in the world. Father Messias had a sister who was a nun in the same convent as Sr. Lucia of  Fatima.

Pope Paul VI holds the hand of Sister Lucia as they stand at the base of the statue of Our Lady of Fatima in the  Basilica at Fatima, Portugal.  https://creativecommons.org/publicdomain/mark/1.0/

According to Fatima-based reporter, Richard Salbato, “...the Sisters were very much interested in Gibson's  2004 film, The Passion of the Christ. They wanted to see the film as a devotional aid in preparation for Good Friday and Faster. However they did not have a DVD player for a private showing of the movie. When Gibson heard of their plight, he not only arranged for a private showing but also secretly flew to  Coimbra, Portugal with his wife Robyn Moore, and Father Luis Condor to bring his film to Sister Lucia  and her Sisters in the cloister.”  

This gripping interview below was conducted with Mr. Salbato while he was still residing in Fatima.  

Salbato said he felt a certain grace from Our Lady and Sister Lucia while living in and writing from Fatima. Salbato echoed the comments of Pope Pius XII, who called Fatima, ‘the holy  mountain of Fatima’ and ‘terra de Santa Maria’—land of Holy Mary and “this perfumed oasis  of faith and piety.”

Our Lady of Fatima, Taken on 18 February 2009 Author ologoodwill Source Flickr.com https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by/2.0/

Pope John XXIII addressing the assembled Fathers at the opening of the Second Vatican Council https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by/2.0/

After attending Sister Lucia’s funeral, while still in Fatima, Salbato consented to this Q&A interview with me...which to date has never been published.

Could you tell us a little bit about your background?

Although born and baptized a Catholic, my parents knew nothing of religion and soon fell away  before I had any religious training. So it was not until an older age that I came to even think  about God. I saw that atheism and evolution were simply international fabricated lies with no  logic or facts to back them up. The only logical solution from a scientific point of view was an  eternal motion that started all other motions. The only logical explanation for energy and matter  was an eternal energy. From that thinking, I came to believe in God and from that belief I came  to understand that the only logical religion of God was the Catholic Church, because all others  were illogical. However, when I came into the Catholic Church I found that it had been  infiltrated by communists, homosexuals, liberals and false apparitions often supporting these  infiltrations or going into extreme heresy to counteract them.

Is Salbato a name of Spanish or Italian ancestry?

It's Italian.  

How would you describe your ministry?

I never intended to have any ministry. I owned my own business and just wanted to practice my  faith. But almost on the first day into the Church I was attacked by Catholic Charismatics and  mystics from all over the world and their extremely enthusiastic promoters. I became personally  involved with a false mystic, who said God had great plans for me and gave me personal  messages from God. In fact, I was personally involved with and believed in at least 12 false  apparitions in the late 60s. In time I wrote simple booklets exposing the truth about these and  helped get people away from them. In time, people came to me with other apparitions and asked  me to investigate them. This I did for the next 35 years taking me to 29 countries. I wrote  booklets, books and made audio tapes. Then came the website.

Why did you choose the name Unity Publishing?

I read Ut Unum Sint and knew that was my vocation - that they would be one. We are not united  within the Church or on the outside of it, but if we were, we would take over the world.

Basilica at Fatima, Portugal Gerd Eichmann September 25 1983  https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-sa/4.0/

What drives you to do what you do for the defense of the faith?

What is the legacy of Fatima for today's Catholics?

What is the legacy if any, for non-believers?

Fatima has all but destroyed atheism throughout the world although little pockets of it remain.

"I want all my children to recognize that the consecration of Russia to the Immaculate  Heart of Mary is the reason for the conversion of Russia." (Our Lady of Fatima). What are  your thoughts on this?  

Paolo Porsia Our Lady of Fatima https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-sa/2.0/

Although it is not yet a complete conversion, it is a miraculous conversion away from  Communism. Someday we will look back and say that Fatima saved the world and gave us a  worldwide period of peace and unity.

How would you define reparation in faith terms?
We are all required to make reparation for sins against others as a condition of penance in confession. However, when we cannot through no fault of our own, Christ has done so for us at the Cross. Because we are cells in the mystical body of Christ, everything we do above and beyond our own needs for reparation is attributed to others in the Body of Christ. We are asked at Fatima to make reparation for the sins against Mary by doing the Five First Saturdays. But from a practical matter, if we have harmed someone and can undo this harm in any way, we have an obligation to do so.

How can a lay Catholic live a life of reparation?

Is reparation a new dogma of faith? If not, what are the roots of the concept of reparation  in the Catholic tradition?

Reparation goes back to the Old Testament where the symbolic sacrifices were offered up for  sins. I say "symbolic" because they were symbolic of the ultimate sacrifice Christ made on the  cross. As I said above, Christ made the ultimate reparation for all sins but that does not take  away our obligation to make reparation if we can for ourselves and others.  

Is the term "offer it up" part of your vocabulary as a Catholic?  

If so, how do you incorporate this in your daily life?

What can I offer up, except the greatest sacrifice of reparation in the world--the Holy Mass. That  is why I have attended daily Mass for over 30 years. All the sacrifices I would do in a lifetime  would not equal one Mass.

Sculpture—Christ Carries His Cross  https://creativecommons.org/publicdomain/zero/1.0/

Do you believe that the Catholic Church is the one true church?

The Catholic Church is not everything, it is the only thing. There is no other Church of God.  Vatican II never said that other religions are roads to Heaven, and in fact they are not. People  outside the Church can make it to Heaven in some few and unusual ways through the Mercy of God, but not through their Churches but through the one and only Catholic Church. My personal  opinion is that there are very few in the 20th Century who could make it outside the physical  body of the Church.

Holy Trinity and Purgatory. Original from the Minneapolis Institute of Art.  https://creativecommons.org/publicdomain/zero/1.0/

Pope Benedict XVI in St. Peter's Square, Rome (2007)  https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-sa/3.0/

Pope Benedict XVI said on Jan. 12, 2011 in a general audience that “Purgatory is a process  and not a place.” 

I have no problem with the Holy Father’s comments. I was very informed of this at the time and had  no problem with it because we do not know how spirits exist and where. Purgatory is the process of  cleansing in a place of cleansing.

Do you think that Limbo of the Infants, like Purgatory, is at the edge of Heaven? 

No not paradise, but Limbo is not Hell. So, it is Heaven. 

Leonardo Da Vinci- The Holy Infants  https://creativecommons.org/publicdomain/mark/1.0/

Do you think there is a distinction in the Holy Scriptures that many Catholics/Christians miss in Luke 23:43 (And Jesus said to him: “Amen I say to thee, this day thou shalt be with  me in paradise.”) 

Christ did not go to Heaven until Sunday. So paradise is not Heaven. 

In your booklet, 'The Bible is a Catholic Book' you make a compelling case that the  Catholic Church is the visible kingdom of heaven on earth. Is that your contention?  In your opinion, does the Catholic Church (in the modern age) do an adequate job of really  communicating this?

This is not new, in Fundamentals of Catholic Dogma under "The concept Church" on page 270  you will read under synonymous designations, Kingdom of Heaven.  

Do you think most Catholics realize that the kingdom is already here on the earth?

This is sad, but No! And this teaching would convert many Protestants who wait for the  Kingdom that is already here.

In your opinion, is the Catholic Church the heir of the covenant promises made to ancient  Israel?

If I did not have this opinion, I would not be Catholic, because the Catholic Church is the real  thing that the old covenant was just a shadow of or the promise of. This is what made me see that  only the Catholic Church really lives up to the Bible because the entire Bible is about the  sacrifice of Calvary from the symbolic sacrifices of old to the real ones at our Masses throughout  the world and opening us up to the same eternal Mass in the heavens.

What is your take on 2 Samuel 7:13.16 where the Lord promised David that he will  establish the throne of his kingdom forever compared with Hosea 3:4 where the Lord said  that the children of Israel shall sit many days without a king, & without a prince & without  sacrifice, & without altar, & without ephod (garments worn by the High priest), & without  theraphim (images or representations)? Was the throne itself established forever or was there  to be an uninterrupted line of kings? If so, what happened after 586 B.C. till the time of  Christ?

King David-the king of Israel https://creativecommons.org/publicdomain/mark/1.0/

God's promise to David is interesting in that he promises his kingdom forever. From this passage  comes the belief that blood lines of the kings of Europe are extremely important and of divine  right. Almost all the kings of Europe carry some of the same blood line and many believe it does  back to Constantine the Great. Others say that through his mother, the blood line of European  kings goes back to the brother of St. Joseph. To see why they believe this you have to see that  God also promised Solomon a kingdom forever, (3 Kings 9:5) "I shall establish your throne over  Israel forever, as I promised your father and there shall not fail a man of thy race upon the throne  of Israel." Now we know that in (2 Samuel 7) God was speaking of Christ. But I believe because  of 3 Kings that He was also speaking of earthly kings. Now consider Matthew (1:6) where David  begot Solomon but this line goes to Joseph, who was not the direct blood of Christ, but in Luke  (3:31) he uses David's son Nathan as the line to Mary and the direct blood of Christ. So Solomon  is not the line to Christ. But the line to the earthly kings and Nathan is the line to Christ that  ended with Christ. What does all this mean? I think we will see in the future. Remember this,  even if we do not consider someone the rightful king, maybe God does, and even if they did not  have a real throne, maybe God still considered them the rightful earthly king.

Do you think that the promise of the Davidic throne was conditional?  Was it unbroken? Was it ultimately fulfilled by Christ or will it yet be in the new heaven  and new earth? I once read that Abraham Lincoln was disappointed in his reading the  scriptures because he perceived that the prophecy was not fulfilled. 

King David by Gustave Moreau  https://creativecommons.org/publicdomain/mark/1.0/

Mary is the seed of David and therefore Christ and Christ is the King of the Kingdom of Heaven on Earth, the Church. 

The seal of Opus Dei. A cross inscribed in a circle: the Cross embracing the world - sanctity in the middle of the world.  Albsr95 22 April 2016 https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-sa/4.0/

Any thoughts on Opus Dei?

Do you believe that these are the 'end times' often mentioned in the Protestant view of  biblical prophecy?

Do you think that the invasion of Iraq by the United States led coalition in 2003 could be  viewed through the lens of biblical prophecy?

No! I see Islam as self-destructing and of no danger until the coming of the Antichrist, who I see  as uniting Islam, Jews and Catholics into his pluralistic religion. The dangers I now see are China  (as far as war is concerned) and the European constitution (as far as non-physical war is  concerned) and both are wars.

How would you briefly describe what is referred to as the Triumph of the Immaculate Heart of Mary as revealed at Fatima?

Maria Immaculata, signiert, datiert Carl Faust 1917  https://creativecommons.org/publicdomain/mark/1.0

I have no real idea, but I have written a 1000 words on this. To me, and this is only my opinion,  there cannot be a triumph until the Christian world is united and there is peace. This cannot  happen as long as we are in a war with each other in the Church, and at war with most governments of the world. To me, communism must end even in China and Cuba, and governments giving back our rights throughout the world. The wall of separation was meant to  protect churches from governments, and not governments from churches.

As an American, what is it like living in Fatima? Do you speak the language at all?

The Fatima shrine and priests are wonderful but the city of Fatima is not holy. In fact in most of  the hotels and stores in Fatima, people do not even go to Church. I, however, live in the little  village where the children lived and the people here are wonderful. In Fatima there is no great  need to learn the language because almost everyone speaks some English.

Do you consider Fatima the altar of the world? If so, what does this really mean?

This is what the Holy Father said of it. In some ways I think of it as a gateway to Heaven or a  staircase to Heaven. Not only because of the millions of people who come here but because  Heaven has come here so often. Not only did Portugal become a nation because of an apparition  of Our Lady in the eighth century, but She appeared on this mountain 700 years ago and again  500 years ago, and Blessed Nuno (*a national hero of Portugal and now a canonized saint) had an  apparition right on the spot of the Fatima apparitions many years ago. Counting the apparitions  of the angel, this mountain has had more separate apparitions than any place in the world.  

Have you ever met Sister Lucia, one of the original seers at Fatima?

Sister Lucia in the Chapel of the Apparitions, next to the column which marks the exact place where the Apparitions  of Our Lady took place. The picture was taken during Lucia's visit to Cova da Iria on May 22, 1946 https://creativecommons.org/publicdomain/mark/1.0/

Were you concerned about what would happen to the Catholic Church after Pope John  Paul II passed on?

No! I believe in Don Bosco's prophesy (see quote below) that the next pope will lead us to peace

between the pillars of the Mass and Our Lady.  

“Very grave trials await the Church. What we have suffered so far is almost nothing compared to what is  going to happen. The enemies of the Church are symbolized by the ships which strive their utmost to sink the flagship. Only two things can save us in such a grave hour: devotion to Mary and frequent  Communion. Let us do our very best to use these two means and have others use them everywhere.” 

What Christian unity do you think is realistically possible in our lifetimes?

There is no unity among Protestants and the disunity is growing all the time. There is no unity  among the Orthodox and the disunity is growing all the time. Only in the Catholic Church is  there unity. I think the Orthodox will see this and join us in Mass, but the Protestants only one  person at a time. This is happening.

I corresponded with noted best-selling author and priest Father Malachi Martin before his death. 

What was your connection with Father Malachi Martin? Were there suspicious circumstances regarding his death?

I also corresponded with Malachi Martin a great deal in the last years of his life. We agreed on some things and some things we did not. However, when he died, (all his close friends feel he was killed and so do I), people tried to sabotage his website and have him say things that he never said. They intimidated his webmaster in an attempt to take over his web site, so I bought the website and kept it exactly as he left it, without any changes. The book he was writing at the time was stolen.

Do you agree with Mother Teresa's comments that communion in the hand is the greatest sin in the world today?

In one way she was right. When you treat God commonly, you open up the door to every other  sin. If you worship God and treat him with a proper worship and respectful awe, He gives you  the grace to see and overcome all other sins.

Saint Mother Teresa of Calcutta 1988 Personal picture taken by Evert Odekerken https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by/2.5/

On June 29th 1972, Pope Paul VI said that "the smoke of Satan has entered the Sanctuary." What do you think he meant by this and do you agree?

Yes! He said that after learning about Schillebeeck's heresies about the Body and Blood of Christ  in the Eucharist. Later through a book called "Christ Among Us" by Anthony Wilhelm, this  heresy swept through the seminaries of the world.

Paulus VI by Fotografia Felici 1969 https://creativecommons.org/publicdomain/mark/1.0/

What has Fatima meant to you personally?

If I make it to Heaven and I trust that I will, it will be in the arms of Our Lady of Fatima.

*Rick Salbato passed away in California as his daughter and granddaughter were  praying the rosary with him. According to his daughter, the Holy Rosary her father  prayed with every day was made by Sister Lucia’s hand (see below) and personally given to him when he lived in Fatima, Portugal.

Photo provided by the family of Rick Salbato

Image by copyright holder: I. SajoR Coat of Arms of U.S. Bishop Curtis J. Guillory   https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-sa/2.5

His daughter also received an e-mail from the Carmelite Sisters of Coimbra after her father’s passing. The Sisters are a cloistered order who live in the convent where Sister Lucia lived and died.

Convent in Coimbra where Sister Lucia lived April 2014 Photo credit: By ANTONINO B @nisantaniello

Saints to examine, to see whether she lived a life of 'heroic virtue'. She was declared “venerable” by Pope Francis on June 22, 2023. 

Anthony M. Davi is a freelance writer based in San Diego

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